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Siamo tornati dall' SES di Milano!
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Wednesday, June 20, 2007 at 1:16 PM
Posted by Luisella & Stefano, Search Quality Team, Dublin
Un paio di chiarimenti...
Ciao! Siamo appena rientrati da un breve soggiorno in Italia. Tempo fantastico! Abbiamo
partecipato come spettatori al Search Engine Strategies conference a Milano nei giorni 29 e
30 maggio. La conferenza è stato davvero una fantastica opportunità per parlare con molti
di voi! Ci ha fatto molto piacere esserci e vorrei ringraziare tutti quelli che si sono fermati
semplicemente a salutare o a discutere di strategie dei motori di ricerca. Abbiamo avuto la
possibilità di parlare con diversi dei partecipanti e con alcuni dei più importanti attori del
mondo SEO e Web Search Marketing in Italia. Discussioni utili e fruttuose per molti aspetti.
Si e' parlato di come il mercato Web si stia sviluppando in Italia, di strategie SEO e di
evangelizzazione (la traduzione italiana suona veramente forte).
Un buon numero di voi è saltato fuori con domande interessanti, e mi piacerebbe ora
esporre un caso per poi fornire un paio di chiarificamenti che siano chiari e concisi.
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Allora partiamo. Questa è la situazione in cui un webmaster potrebbe ritrovarsi: ho
ottimizzato questo sito utilizzando tecniche non in accordo con le linee guida di Google. Ce
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la siamo cavata per un po', e questo ci ha aiutato a raggiungere la seconda posizione nei
risultati di ricerca per alcune parole chiave. Ad un certo punto però, abbiamo ricevuto una
email dal team della qualità della ricerca di Google che diceva che il nostro sito non
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sarebbe stato momentaneamente più presente nell'indice (nelle email c'è sempre almeno un
esempio delle tecniche utilizzate). Abbiamo allora sistemato il sito togliendo tutto ciò che
non era conforme alle linee guida e dopo alcuni giorni il nostro sito era di nuovo presente
nell'indice. Come è possibile che non è più posizionato in seconda posizione nonostante il
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fatto che abbiamo rimosso tutto ciò che non era conforme alle linee guida?!
Va bene, lasciatemi fare un paio di domande prima di rispondere.
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Non avete ottimizzato il sito utilizzando quelle tecniche al fine di posizionarlo il meglio
possibile artificialmente?
Non pensavate che quelle tecniche avrebbero funzionato, almeno in una prospettiva
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di breve periodo?
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Quindi se c'è stato un utilizzo di tecniche spam, incoraggiamo il sito che ha ricevuto la
information about Google
notifica da Google a prendere la cosa seriamente. Molti ripuliscono il proprio sito dalle
blogs.
tecniche scorrette di ottimizzazione dopo aver ricevuto una nostra notifica, ma noi dobbiamo
anche tenere in considerazione che oltre a quelle presenti sul sito (per esempio testo
nascosto, redirecting doorway page, etc) spesso ci sono anche tecniche utilizzate al di fuori Labels
del sito stesso come link popularity artificiali per guadagnarsi un’ottima posizione nelle
accessibility (8)
pagine dei risultati di ricerca di Google.
crawling and indexing (84)
Quindi, per rendere la questione più chiara possibile, una volta che ognuna delle
events (40)
manipolazioni sopra citate, inserite ai fini del posizionamento, e’ stata rimossa, il sito torna
ad occupare la posizione che merita sulla base dei suoi contenuti e della sua link popularity feedback and communication
naturale. C'è in oltre da evidenziare che il posizionamento del vostro sito dipende anche
(55)
dagli altri siti relazionati al vostro per argomento trattato e tali siti nel frattempo potrebbero
general tips (40)
essere stati ottimizzati correttamente, va da sé che questo avrebbe un impatto anche sulla
vostra posizione.
products and services (29)
Notate che non c’è alcun tipo di penalizzazione preventiva applicata a quei siti che, ora
puliti, hanno però visto in precedenza un utilizzo di tecniche non consentite. E questo è un
punto a cui teniamo particolarmente: non rimangono né malus né macchie nella storia di un
sito.
E' per questo motivo che insistiamo fermamente nel consigliare di lavorare sodo sui propri
contenuti in modo che siano una risorsa che abbia valore per gli utenti, essendo proprio il
buon contenuto una delle risorse più importanti che alimentano una link populary naturale e
tutti dovremmo ormai sapere quanto una tale popolarità possa essere solida.
Qualità della ricerca, qualità dei contenuti e l'esperienza dei tuoi lettori.
search results (38)
sitemaps (27)
webmaster guidelines (22)
webmaster quiz (2)
webmaster tools (74)
We love feedback!
Post a comment on the blog
or visit our discussion forum
Tra le varie conversazioni sulla qualità della ricerca, una su tutte ricorreva più spesso. Mi
riferisco alle landing page e come scrivere per i motori di ricerca, due temi che spesso
viaggiano in coppia quando si parla di risultati organici di ricerca.
Pensiamo allora al tuo visitatore che ha cercato qualcosa con Google e ha trovato la tua
pagina. Ora, che tipo di accoglienza gli stai riservando? Una buona esperienza di ricerca
consiste nel trovare una pagina che contiene l'informazione necessaria per rispondere alla
domanda posta all'inizio.
Tuttavia un errore frequente nello scrivere per motori di ricerca é dimenticare proprio il
visitatore e focalizzare l'attenzione solo sulla sua domanda. In effetti potremmo sostenere,
"é con quella chiave di ricerca che hanno trovato la mia pagina!"
Alla fine dei conti, esasperare un comportamento del genere potrebbe portare a creare
pagine fatta "su misura" per rispondere a quella ricerca ma con ben poco contenuto. Pagine
del genere spesso utilizzano tecniche quali, tra l'altro, pure ripetizioni di parole, contenuti
duplicati e in generale minimo contenuto. Ricapitolando, possono anche essere a tema con
la domanda posta - ma per il tuo visitatore, sono inutili. In altri termini, hai finito per creare
una pagina scritta solo per i motori di ricerca e ti sei dimenticato del visitatore. Il risultato é
che l'utente trova pagine all'apparenza a tema ma in realtà completamente insignificanti.
Queste pagine "insignificanti", fatte artificialmente per generare traffico dai motori, non
rappresentano una buona esperienza di ricerca. Anche se non adottano tecniche scorrette,
quali ad esempio testo o links nascosti, sono fatte solo ed esclusivamente per posizionarsi
per specifiche parole chiave, o combinazioni di parole, ma in realtà non offrono
autonomamente alcun valore come risultato di una ricerca.
Un primo approccio per capire se stai causando una cattiva esperienza di ricerca ai tuoi
utenti é controllare che le pagine trovate siano davvero utili. Queste pagine avranno
contenuto a tema, che risponde alla domanda originalmente posta dall'utente ed in generale
sono significative e rilevanti. Potresti cominciare con il controllo delle pagine che ricevono
più visite e passare poi a rivedere tutto il sito. E per concludere, un consiglio: in generale,
anche quando si vuole ottimizzare la pagina affinché il motore la trovi facilmente, bisogna
ricordarsi che i visitatori sono il tuo pubblico e che una pagina scritta per i motori di ricerca
non soddisfa necessariamente le aspettative del visitatore in termini di qualità e contenuti.
Allora se stai pensando a come scrivere per il motore di ricerca, pensa invece ai tuoi utenti
e a qual é il valore che stai offrendo loro!
We're back from SES Milan!
...with a couple of clarifications
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Ciao everybody! We just got back from Italy—great weather there, I must say! We attended Central de Conversiones
SES in Milan on the 29th and 30th of May. The conference was a great opportunity to talk
to many of you. We really had a good time and want to thank all the people who stopped by Jetzt neu in Google Mail:
to simply say "hi" or to talk to us in more detail about search engine strategies. This gave
Hinweise auf verdächtige
us a chance to talk to many participants and many of the big Italian actresses and actors in
Kontoaktivitäten
the SEO and web marketing worlds. We discussed recent developments in the Italian
Der Google Produkt-Kompass
internet market, SEO strategies and evangelizing.
A number of you have raised interesting questions, and we'd like to go through two of these
in more detail.
Google Buzz Tips for Teens
Google Public Policy Blog
This is a situation a webmaster might find himself/herself in: I optimized this site using some ‫תוצאות טובות יותר למפרסמים‬
sneaky techniques that are not in accordance with Google´s Webmaster Guidelines. I got
‫ ברשת התוכן של‬Google
away with it for a while and it helped me to rank in second position for certain keywords.
‫מחדש‬
‫"באמצעות "שיווק‬
Then, suddenly, I got an email from Google saying my site has been banned from the index
because of those techniques (in these emails there is always an example of one of the
Inside AdWords - IL
infractions found). I now have cleaned up the site and after some days the site was back in
the index.
Why on earth doesn't my site rank in the second position anymore, even though I've already
paid for the sneaky techniques we used?
Google Webmaster Central
Blog is powered by Blogger.
OK, before answering let me ask you a couple of questions:
Start your own weblog.
Didn't you optimize your site with those techniques in order to artificially boost the
ranking?
Didn't you think those techniques had worked out (in a short term perspective at
least)?
So, if there has been spamming going on, we encourage a site that has gotten an email
from Google to take this notification seriously. Many people clean up their sites after
receiving a notification from us. But we must also take into account that besides the shady
SEO techniques used on a particular site (for instance hidden text, redirecting doorway
pages, etc) there are often off-site SEO techniques used such as creating artificial link
popularity in order to gain a high position in Google's SERPs.
So, to make it straightforward, once those manipulations to make a site rank unnaturally
high are removed, the site gains the position it merits based on its content and its natural
link popularity. Note that of course the ranking of your site also depends on other sites
related to the same topic and these sites might have been optimized in accordance to our
guidelines, which might affect the ranking of your site.
Note that a site does not keep a stain or any residual negative effect from a prior breach of
our webmaster guidelines, after it has been cleaned up.
That is why we first and foremost recommend to work hard on the content made for the
audience of your site, as the content is a decisive factor for building natural link popularity.
We all know how powerful a strong natural link popularity can be.
Search quality, content quality and your visitor's experience.
During our conversations about search-related issues, another topic that came up frequently
was landing pages and writing for search engines, which are often related when we
consider organic search results.
So, think of your visitors who have searched for something with Google and have found
your page. Now, what kind of welcome are you offering? A good search experience consists
of finding a page that contains enough information to satisfy your original query.
A common mistake in writing optimized content for search engines is to forget about the
user and focus only on that particular query. One might say, that's how the user landed on
my page!
At the end of that day, exaggerating this attitude might lead to create pages only made to
satisfy that query but with no actual content on them. Such pages often adopt techniques
such as, among others, mere repetition of keywords, duplicate content and overall very little
value. In general, they might be in line with the keywords of the query – but for your visitor,
they’re useless. In other words, you have written pages solely for the search engine and
you forgot about the user. As a result, your visitor will find a page apparently on topic but
totally meaningless.
These “meaningless” pages, artificially made to generate search engine traffic, do not
represent a good search experience. Even though they do not employ other not
recommendable techniques, such as for examples hidden text and links, they are very much
made solely for the purpose of ranking for particular keywords, or a set of keywords, but
actually are not offering a satisfying search result in itself.
A first step to identify if you are causing a bad search experience for your visitor consists of
checking that the pages that he or she finds are actually useful. They will have topical
content, that satisfies the query for which your visitor has found it and are overall
meaningful and relevant. You might want to start with the pages that are most frequently
found and extend your check up to your entire site. To sum up, as general advice, even if
you want to make a page that is easily found via search engines, remember that the users
are your audience, and that a page optimized for the search engine does not necessarily
meet the user's expectations in terms of quality and content. So if you find yourself writing
content for a search engine, you should ask yourself what the value is for the user!
Labels: events
The comments you read here belong only to the person who posted them. We do, however,
reserve the right to remove off-topic comments.
19 comments:
DLPerry said...
"These “meaningless” pages, artificially made to generate search engine traffic, do
not represent a good search experience. Even though they do not employ other not
recommendable techniques, such as for examples hidden text and links, they are
very much made solely for the purpose of ranking for particular keywords, or a set
of keywords, but actually are not offering a satisfying search result in itself."
Any hints, tips, instructions, etc. on how to get rid of all these useless pages that
keep showing up in search results for a domain query (ex: www.domain.name)
The ones I've seen most appear to be from GoDaddy, from a Chinese domain, and
even a few porn sites.
Reporting via GWT seems to get limited results - some sites have been moved to
supplemental - but they are still there. Granted - the porn is removed fairly quickly only to re-appear a few days later.
I've not mentioned an actual domain here to avoid having this comment appear in
the serps too, but I am of course eager and more than willing to discuss details with
a Google representative privately.
JUNE 21, 2007 1:49 AM
Sante J. Achille said...
Un saluto a Luisella & Stefano, è stato un piacere conoscervi. Abbiamo avuto delle
discussioni interessanti al SES di Milano - io continuerò a farmi sentire - sapete a
cosa mi riferisco ;-)
JUNE 21, 2007 2:20 AM
song's webdesign said...
It would be critical to see some of my sites get the lower ranks... I do agree with
dlperry. I am sure SEO people including Google will build good and better and
better policies and reactions..
JUNE 21, 2007 2:32 PM
Sin said...
No kidding. I'm one who's is sicc of irrevelant results at times and spoof pages.
JUNE 24, 2007 1:57 PM
Willy Lures said...
I hate to be a stick in the mud, but the multi-language posts are a little annoying to
look at.
Can't you do some sort of set-up that recognizes the ip range... er something like
that. Never done it myself, but I thought there was a way to tell roughly WHERE the
reader is located. Then apply a language script with it.
Just a suggestion....
JUNE 26, 2007 11:52 AM
Robert said...
"So, if there has been spamming going on, we encourage a site that has gotten an
email from Google to take this notification seriously. Many people clean up their
sites after receiving a notification from us."
I'm confused - I thought you didn't send emails?
How do you notify "people"?
JUNE 26, 2007 2:07 PM
Susan Moskwa said...
Robert:
You're right that we've temporarily stopped sending these emails (see our previous
blog post for details). As Riona mentions, we're exploring more secure ways of
notifying webmasters about issues related to their sites; so although we're not
sending emails at this very moment, the general notion of "we encourage you to
take [a notification from Google] seriously" still stands.
JUNE 27, 2007 9:41 AM
PeterF said...
I apologize in advance if this is a dumb question, but in terms of spamming, is this
a scenario of spamming?
I have a particular example, when doing a (site:domain name) search for a site
called www.cufflinksdepot.com it pulls up all of the pages found from google. In
looking further, all of the pages on the site are found 2, 3,4 times within the same
site search. Is this considered spamming? Somehow having the same pages show
up with identical content and actually being the exact same page? By duplicating
the pages somehow to manipulate the google search, does the site size help in it's
natural listings? The site probably is a 3rd of the size that it shows on google due to
these repeating pages.
Is this spamming as well? For argument's sake, within the same site:search
the cufflinksdepot has a lot of htm pages that do not have content or have content
not relevant to its subject matterhttp://www.cufflinksdepot.com/dir-funny-cufflinks.htm
http://www.cufflinksdepot.com/dir-miscellaneous.htm
http://www.cufflinksdepot.com/dir-tiffany-cufflinks.htm
It has many more of these pages as well. Htm pages are obviously visible and some
of these methods seem to be working because they are listed 1st organically.
What are htm pages and how does google handle these types of pages?
JUNE 27, 2007 9:52 AM
Robert said...
Susan:
My site is suffering from a -950 (penalty?). I follow the "webmaster guidelines" to
the letter.
I can't imagine what the problem could be.
Nobody from Google has made a direct public comment on the -950 issue.
Google currently does not notify webmasters about issues.
So, what do I do? Just wait?
This is very frustrating!
JUNE 27, 2007 10:22 AM
Igor Berger said...
Susan can you do one on supplementary!
Thank you,
Igor
JUNE 29, 2007 6:46 AM
webmaster said...
Currently we have 7 backlinks down from over 1000 last year. Still have well over
1000 on Overture. Google has no live people to help me with the questions, "Why?
", "How can we remedy this problem ourselves?" and if it is complicated, "How do
we find a company that specializes in analysis and recommendations on how to
repair this problem?" Thanks. Barbara
JUNE 29, 2007 4:42 PM
giorgiotave said...
Wow :)
Un saluto da Giorgio Taverniti, vado a commentare meglio nel blog in Italiano va :D
JUNE 30, 2007 5:58 AM
Susan Moskwa said...
Robert & Webmaster:
If you're looking for detailed help/advice about issues specific to your website, I'd
encourage you to post your URL in our Webmaster Help forum. There are lots of
smart folks there who can help you diagnose issues and answer specific questions.
JULY 2, 2007 9:56 AM
PeterF said...
Hello Susan,
Can you assist me in understanding the htm question? Do search engines view htm
pages as html pages?
thank you for any clarification.
JULY 2, 2007 12:19 PM
robert said...
"If you're looking for detailed help/advice about issues specific to your website, I'd
encourage you to post your URL in our Webmaster Help forum. There are lots of
smart folks there who can help you diagnose issues and answer specific questions."
Susan:
I did just that, but didn't get any help.
What's strange is there are lots of people with the same problem, but nobody from
Google will comment.
JULY 2, 2007 1:30 PM
Brian & Margie Rapid City, SD said...
I agree with Robert's statement about lack of help on the Webmaster
Help forum.
For example, Google has stated that the supplimental index isn't a penalty. It may
not be a penalty in Google's eyes, but to me and many others, it's a problem.
Today I discovered that doing a search for a specific character string placed in
quotes vs a no quote search yielded startling results! A page in the primary index of
my site shows up for unquoted search string with only the link anchor text, yet a
supplimental the information page is lost until you add the quotes around the string.
Both pages are on the same website, so Google is misleading people in my opinion
when they state supplimentals are no big deal.
When link anchor text alone ranks higher than a content page, there is something
wrong...where can I really get help with this type of problem
JULY 15, 2007 5:10 PM
Pablo Adrian Lari said...
alguien me puede ayudar tengo problemas de indexacion en google. desde ya
gracias.
AUGUST 3, 2007 9:43 PM
Yasir said...
LOVE IS LIFE
AUGUST 6, 2007 4:17 PM
Google Webmaster Central said...
Hi everyone,
Since several months have passed since we published this post, we're closing the
comments to help us focus on the work ahead. If you still have a question or
comment you'd like to discuss, free to visit and/or post your topic in our Webmaster
Help Group.
Thanks and take care,
The Webmaster Central Team
APRIL 24, 2008 10:24 PM
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